Spoiler alert. If you haven't done this quest, read at your own risk or hit the 'back' button.



If you get the haunted manor quest, wherein you're giving the option of retrieving nekker eyes and hearts for the soldier, you're also presented (in dialog only) the option of acquiring the eyes and hearts of pigs. Since you probably already have nekker guts by this time, the easiest recourse is to run downstairs and turn them in; the quest log even says you're ready to turn in nekker guts; it mentions nothing of pig guts, so my inclination is to think the pig guts reference was added for flavor.

However, being the explorer that I am, and because I thought the "poetic" aspect of turning in pig guts was a great idea, I went to the butcher, and he did indeed sell me pig hearts and eyes as a quest item. I was very pleased. Back to the manor, hand them to the wraight .... and you get exactly the same result: he takes the pig guts (at least, they're no longer in your inventory) and knows you're trying to trick him, and you have to fight him.

So, now I'm really disappointed. The devs thought to implement what seemed like a great, largely undocumented way to lift the curse without having to fight the wraith, but instead of following through, they make you fight the wraith anyway. Is this a bug, or is it yet another demonstration of gross oversight?

Much as I truly love (and sometimes hate) this game, it's moments like this that make me want to wait for the patch that makes the Witcher 2 the game it's supposed to be, not the game they were forced to throw at the masses.

The spoiler is in the title! Change the title.

I wouldn't call that a bug or even something missing from the game but more a classic "choice & consequence", just because you have a "choice" doesn't mean said choice will work well in the end.

You tried to fool the wraith and it didn't work so you had to fight it... and it wasn't really undocumented as one of the two dude told you that you could use either Nekker or pig organ to try to fool the wraith.

*SPOILERS*
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Geralt tried to trick a wraith and it didn't work, what's the problem exactly?

This has nothing to do with patches or whatever, the dialogues clearly tell you that Geralt tried to trick the wraith but the wraith saw right trough Geralt's bullshit. I don't even know what that "game they were forced to throw at the masses" remark is supposed to mean, the quest plays out as the writers intended it to play out. For a sidequest that is largely incosequential i'd say the level of choice is spot on and that Geralt faling miserably at trying to bullshit the wraith is a pretty good wrinkle.

It seems you're trying really hard to find something to complain about and just like Geralt with the wraith you're failing miserably at it.

I'm sorry about the spoiler title; I should have known. Unfortunately, I can't change it now, nor can I delete the original post. If you're a mod, feel free to do either.

I take insult at your assumption of my intent, Namur. That said, please let me explain my point.

My point is, why provide an option that isn't really an option? This is an ongoing issue that I, personally, as in me, not you, have with the series, where the idea is that we have choices when, in fact, we don't. It's a carrot-on-a-stick issue for me. It is clearly not an issue for you or anyone else. I apologize profusely for assuming, in my arrogance, that a forum about discussing games encouraged the discussion of games. My bad. My point is, the writer(s) didn't even *acknowledge* that I tried to find a way around this particular problem using information *they* had given me!

What would have made it better — what would have prevented me from even wanting to complain — is if I'd been given the *option* of handing over nekker guts or pig guts. (Oddly, when you acquire both, the quest says you have 4/2 required items, which, to me, implies that the pig guts would have mattered; I didn't even assume it would; I innocently *hoped* it would.) Having handed over pig parts and being allowed the clear understanding that a wraith simply can't be fooled — a wraith scorned, as it were — by *any* parts not of its enemies, I would have not have been annoyed such that I would have cared to post about it.

If you have it in your heart, please forgive me for having thought about the situation, put two and two together, and *not* done exactly what the writer(s) assumed I would do, which to me seemed a very stupid thing. Honestly, I'm supposed to give away nekker parts, which do not at all look human, as opposed to pig parts, which could, at least in the dark of the manor's cellar, be mistaken for human?

Naturally, this is not the root of my issue; it's merely the straw that broke the witcher's back. I did something I thought would matter, that the writer even suggested *might* matter; it didn't. I decided to complain because I have that privilege, and I genuinely have a solid reason for it, but first, to address another issue...

...you're right: I didn't explain my comment "...game they were forced to throw at the masses." I mean a game that doesn't feel quite finished for reasons I have tried very hard to explain. It's no secret that developers don't always get to polish their products. (The menu system in TW2 to me feels very, very unrefined compared to the first game.) I truly do appreciate that you don't take issue with it. You merely take issue with the fact that I don't agree with you. I'm sorry you feel that way.

Let me rest your mind at ease by obliterating the notion that I regret buying the best CRPG I've ever played and then complaining about one "inconsequential" aspect of it — a term I find humorously ironic since my complaint is about a lack of consequence — or two, if you include my reply in a combat thread, which also just happens to be my, as in my own, opinion. This is not the case. I have a love-hate relationship with most games, and in this particular case, my love is significantly higher. In fact, it's the *reason* I started this thread.

Having been a game designer myself for quite a few years, I question these types of things. Game design is not, I repeat NOT easy. Well, okay, design is pretty easy, but *making* that design into a game is not. You will not find one who appreciates this concept more than I do, and very often when I want to complain about something in a genuine effort to help, I don't because the developers won't see it anyway, and if they do, they won't care. Game development, despite being a business, is a very personal endeavor, much like writing a book or directing a film. Here we come to the heart of why I chose to post this particular complaint. I do hope it satisfies you.

My penultimate hope is that this sort of comment, amidst all the other comments by all the other players — no, in *addition* to all the other comments — will somehow find its way into the minds and, subsequently, hearts of the game's developers and make the Witcher 3 — if ever we're allowed such a glorious delight — even better at giving us *relevant* choices, particularly those of us who read between the lines and past the limited quest log.

The seat of my hope lies simply, perhaps foolishly, in that CD Project owns GOG.com — probably pretty obvious since the site is pushing the series so hard — and I'd hoped they would somehow miraculously stumble upon all these threads like mine and take them to heart. This forum is, as I see it (perhaps a bit too poetically), their eyes into their fans' hearts. Audacious, I know, but when presented with such an opportunity, I'd be rather stupid to ignore it.

Yes, is is a bit silly. Yes, you're entitled to ignore that aspect of my thinking and gripe about my opinion. Yes, I think you're pretty silly for it yourself, but I didn't say any of this in the initial post, so. Sorry about that. Thanks for opening my eyes a bit.

I've been planning to post an objective list of UI corrections as well, after I've played more of the game and accumulated said list. I'm rather surprised and disappointed the UI is as utilitarian, unfriendly, and ugly as it is, but never mind that; everyone will have plenty of time to rip on me for that later. And again, maybe the devs will never see it. Somehow I yet feel inclined to try. Who knows? Maybe one or two of our, the fans', observations will make it into a patch. The game isn't dead until the devs decide it is, which is generally about the time people stop talking about it.

Thanks for reading. Again, sorry about the title; someone feel free to fix or delete it.

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Out of curiosity, do you have a save right before you "give" the wraith the pig parts?
If you do, what happens if, before you approach the wraith, you drop all of the nekker parts you have off your inventory?

I am guessing this is yet another issue with the interface being "optimized" for game pads. In the original Witcher, when you needed to give anything to anyone, you got a "drop box" as part of the dialog, and once you clicked it, you were taken to your inventory where you could choose what you were giving to the NPC. In Witcher 2, this is done so automatically... seems like the game is flagging the nekker parts first as being given to the wraith.

The 3 times I have gone through that quest, I always feed the bastards to the wraiths :)

Do you know what would have made it better for yourself?

Especially with regards to your essay?

If you dint write like dandelion and realise that some people lie and others are simply wrong..

That's it.
Nothing more.

Bin your assumptions, your extrapolations and your conclusions... because what you have done above is nothing but argue a philosophy.

Some times life sucks and people talk shit.
Most of the time life doesn't present to you conclusions.
We'll leave that to Mario.

(the bloody thing says you cant fool it... why would two ex soldiers know better than the thing itself)

Damn..look at pathologic. (icepick lodge if you are interested and older than say... 17)

Yes, It is a bit silly & too, no its not.

I seem to be completely missing your point. You're saying that giving the dude pig parts isn't really an option, because it does the same thing as giving him nekker parts. Okay, but the entire point of that option was that you could do it without fighting nekkers! It pretty much says so in the dialogue. It has nothing to do with giving him parts that look more human - if it was that, then you should have had the option of killing humans and taking their eyes to the wraith (which still probably not have worked, since one of the points of that quest is that wraiths can't be fooled).

In any case, the entire point of that option is so you can do it without fighting nekkers. Maybe you killed all of them and it's now difficult to find 'em and you've sold or used all their eyes. Maybe you just don't want to fight any nekkers, or haven't encountered them yet, or don't have the proper amount of knowledge of them to take their eyes.

The actual 'choice and consequence' part of this quest is that you can hand over the people or you can try (and fail) to trick the wraith. Both of these are real choices with real consequences. Just because there are multiple paths to take in a quest that lead to the same result does not mean that there are no choices or consequences in those quests.

You have a ghost that is out for blood, and you think you can trick him? You're supposed to think you might trick him no matter how unlikely it seems! I knew the moment I handed him those fake eyes and the heart that the ghost was gonna have a bad day.

What a long winded load of self important shite.

If you had bothered to look at your journal when when you got the quest update you would have seen that you could give the wraith the nekker parts if you had them in inventory or GO TO THE BUTCHER and buy pigs parts from him, or you could have handed the two guys over to him and been done with the whole thing, your choice.
You also could have handed the two guys over to him and been done with the whole thing.
You chose to not read for 30 seconds and instead whine, cry and sling snot here.

I don't have any issue with someone having a different opinion from the writers about how a character, a sidequest or even the enterity of a main plot should have been written and i surely don't have a problem when someone wants to discuss such differences of opinion. I often bring up or chime in on such discussions, i too find myself often thinking that if it was me doing the writing i would have written this or that aspect differently in this way or that way. However, when that's the case i put forward my case in an honest way by stating " i wish the writers would have written this differently, i think it would have worked out better had they written it this way because...". I don't feel the need to reinforce my own personal subjective opinion with hyperbole or by bringing up moot points for the matter at hand.

My issues with your post were the statements "yet another demonstration of gross oversight" and "it's moments like this that make me want to wait for the patch that makes the Witcher 2 the game it's supposed to be, not the game they were forced to throw at the masses". Both remarks are hyperbole and neither of them is here or there for the topic you yourself brought up.

To be perfectly clear, it wasn't the subject you brought up that made me post, it's how you chose to approach the subject.

Regarding the quest, the devellopers did acknowledge that you tried to find a different outcome by allowing you to hand over the dead bits to try and trick the wraith. But it didn't worked. The wraith's link to the would-be-victims is too strong for anything but the would-be-victims requested body parts to work - that's how i understood Geralt's failure. The 'relevant' choice in this quest was set at an entirely different level: does Geralt tries to save the two men or does he sacrifice them in order to move his own agenda along ?

Regarding the UI/Menus: The UI is pitful, the alchemy and inventory menus are a freaking nightmare, one i wrestle with every time i fire up the game. If you are under the impression i find no fault with the game, you're wrong. There's a pretty healthy number of design aspects i would like to see adressed/tweaked/changed/improved. And once more i point out to you that none of it is relevant to the subject you brought up, which is strictly a writing/creative difference of opinion.

If my comment offended you somehow, i'm sorry about that, that wasn't my intention at all.

I don't think you guys are getting what the OP is trying to say.

His problem is that he went to the wraith with both the pig parts AND the nekker parts on his inventory, but when it came time to give the pig parts to the wraith, as there is no screen to actually give an item to anyone as it was in W1, the game automatically removed the pig parts from his inventory, but flagged the nekker parts as being given to the wraith.


For the record, the game guide says that it is possible to fool the wraith with the pig parts.

This is from the game guide

[Choice] We have several possibilities.
[A] We can accept the ghost’s proposal, kill its tormentors and bring it what it wants. We
can also tell them what the wraith wants. They’ll suggest deceiving the ghost, bringing it the
hearts and eyes of pigs, which are barely different from human ones and readily available from
the Flotsam butcher [3]. If we pick this option, the ghost will buy it. After lifting the curse we
have to decide whether we let Rupert and Gridley go or hand them over to Loredo. [C] We can
also try to give the wraith the eyes and hearts of nekkers, but the ghost will realise we’re trying
to deceive it and will attack us. After defeating it we’ll have to decide whether we let Rupert and
Gridley go or hand them over to Loredo.

what the hell are you trying to say? no offense, but you're trying too hard. don't use words you don't fully understand, and don't force brevity. if an idea takes longer to explain, so be it. as it is, your current post makes zero sense.

Ugh, I know. My current 2nd time through I read it & this frustrated me so much I indeed dropped ALL my Nekker parts before coming back up to try & have ONLY the pig parts to see if the guide was right & did it because the game does not let you choose.

So I thought it was giving the Nekker parts automatically, failing the sneaky disguised remains but alas it STILL fails with no parts but the pigs, guide has been nice this time around, but not always accurate, to say the least.